This post is a reminder that Visa and Mastercard are two american companies and that every time you pay for something with your credit card you are most likely paying taxes to trump and his goons.

This post is also intended to be a provocation to all the crypto haters and the cashless payment fanatics.

  • chmod755@feddit.org
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    5 hours ago

    I often paid with my cards (or my watch), but switched to cash until there is a legit european alternative. Most cryptocurrencies are pump and dump schemes

  • 小莱卡@lemmygrad.ml
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    8 hours ago

    This post is also intended to be a provocation to all the crypto haters and the cashless payment fanatics.

    If your intentionis boycotting the US, pushing crypto ain’t it 😂 americans are the most invested in cryptocurrencies and the current administration more than so.

    • slaneesh_is_right@lemmy.org
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      5 hours ago

      I really like the idea of crypto. But i can’t fucking stand people who like crypto. I used to lure around crypto messaging boards around the time bitcoin blew up and before it crashed. Every other post was like: buy crypto, and use it, apes together strong. That kind of shit. And the next post: haha this loser bought a pizza for 20k dollars worth of bicoin.

      It’s all around just prople pretending to hold btc and tell people to hold btc, just to sell everything as soon as it’s profitable

      • 小莱卡@lemmygrad.ml
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        4 hours ago

        Yea, holders of bitcoin have a vested interest in pushing it to other people so they can sell.

        Bitcoin as an investment is ponzi scheme through and through, it just happens that it can also be used to make transactions.

  • Denixen@feddit.nu
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    11 hours ago

    In Sweden we have Swish, which allows you to pay for stuff online without using any debit or credit card. I use it all the time, I cannot remember last time I paid online with card, unless it was from a foreign online shop/service.

    However, it often isn’t available in grocery and retail stores. But it is often available in rural areas or small shops who don’t want to pay the fee for cards.

    Also, Sweden is developing an e-krona, an electronic version of the Swedish currency. It should hopefully replace cards in all shops in the future.

    Until then, using cash in grocery and retail stores is always possible. The problem is most swedes haven’t seen physical money in so long I am not certain they still know how to use it… 🤔

    • lud@lemm.ee
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      4 hours ago

      You actually can pay in quite a few retail shops using swish nowadays.

      Also loads of stores don’t accept cash at all. Most big stores like grocery stores accept cash but not always all tills

    • biofaust@lemmy.world
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      8 hours ago

      MobilePay in Finland and Denmark. I am not so sure the underlying payment infrastructure is US-free though.

    • przemek@lemm.ee
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      4 hours ago

      Depends on what’s available where you live. In Poland we have BLIK! I think a few other countries are starting to use it too. The way it works is that in your banking app you get a 6 digit code, and enter it in the terminal. Less convenient than tap-to-pay but writing that made me realize how spoiled I am, lol. It’s really convenient for online purchases though, no need to spend all that time writing card info and no risk of that info getting into the wrong hands.

      Some things are harder to replace than others, and no one expects you to change everything anyway. I don’t know why it’s “too absurd”. If anything, our dependence on that makes them all the more important to use/develop alternatives for.

      • lennee@lemm.ee
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        2 hours ago

        Giro payment system läuft getrennt von Visa und Mastercard. Viele Girokarten sind aber eine Kombination aus Giro und Visa oder Masterkarte und da kommt manchmal das Logo her.

  • gon [he]@lemm.ee
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    1 day ago

    Yeah! It’s best to use the national network, if it exists in your country. Also, daily reminder that the EU is working towards the digital Euro.

    This post is also intended to be a provocation to all the crypto haters and the cashless payment fanatics.

    I don’t really get this tbh…

    • Alxe@lemmy.world
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      1 day ago

      The digital euro looks so promising, even if it’s a small thing. Ditching Visa and Mastercard would help reduce intermediates in the payment chain, even if the replacement is the bank itself.

    • index@sh.itjust.worksOP
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      1 day ago

      I don’t really get this tbh…

      Plenty of threads on lemmy where people argue cryptos have no real use. Here’s one: buying a product in europe without paying taxes to donald trump

        • Blackmist@feddit.uk
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          8 hours ago

          Or indeed a place to buy it for real money that doesn’t involve a US payment processing company.

          No point if you have to pay to get it in the first place.

              • Astigma@lemmy.world
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                1 day ago

                I concede that there are online services that aren’t money laundering fronts or drug marketplaces that accept cryptocurrency as payment. OP also provided examples of online services accepting bitcoin.

                I should have been more specific, my mistake. I was thinking more about every day purchases like groceries in a brick and mortar shop.

                • theskyisfalling@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                  1 day ago

                  That is fair enough, I have just seen your other response mentioning brick and mortar stores now as well. I do realise we are in a buy European community but I thought you wanted just one example anywhere of somewhere that accepted crypto.

                  I have seen a couple of places IRL that accepted BTC but they were very small, independent stores that I’m guessing the owners were into crypto and just wanted to add the option as it was their interest. It certainly isn’t something you can rely on to purchase your weekly shop or whatever which I guess is more what you were going for.

            • yetAnotherUser@discuss.tchncs.de
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              1 day ago

              There are also privacy-paranoid companies selling custom mobile phones without microphones for crypto currencies that you can then pick up in person.

              But honestly, I wouldn’t trust them. If your threat level is the government you should purchase a used phone from a random stranger and pay with cash.

      • gon [he]@lemm.ee
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        1 day ago

        Oh thanks for clarifying… I don’t really see those posts, to be honest.

        I do hold some crypto myself (BTC). I think it’s good to have some sort of currency outside of FIAT, just in case, but I don’t foresee it ever becoming a thing in the EU.

  • Astigma@lemmy.world
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    1 day ago

    This post is also intended to be a provocation to all the crypto haters

    When crypto is backed by a regulatory body and isn’t just speculative gambling, I might take it more seriously.

      • Astigma@lemmy.world
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        1 day ago

        Yes, the ones that ensure my money still exists if a bank goes under. Those exact ones.

        • index@sh.itjust.worksOP
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          1 day ago

          One of the reasons bitcoin was made is that there’s no bank that can go under and you always own your money

          • Astigma@lemmy.world
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            1 day ago

            It can also be worthless from one day to the next. I hold BTC, I’ve lost £300 this week. I wouldn’t want to put my whole salary into BTC.

            • index@sh.itjust.worksOP
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              1 day ago

              I hold BTC, I’ve lost £300 this week.

              You are lucky you don’t own any venezuelan bolivars or you could have lost more than that. Real currencies can go down too.

              • VodkaSolution @feddit.it
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                1 day ago

                The call of the bolivars was all but unannounced, while the up and down of BTC and more of less known crypto are waaaaaay less predictable

                • Yeather@lemmy.ca
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                  23 hours ago

                  Much like a volatile currency, though I suppose a better example would be an asset like gold or silver, except you can instantly sell bitcoin back. Look at it less like a currency and more like an asset.

          • FozzyOsbourne@lemm.ee
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            23 hours ago

            Except for all those cryptocurrency exchanges that keep going down and taking everyone’s money

                • index@sh.itjust.worksOP
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                  11 hours ago

                  You’re not forced to use a normal bank, you can keep your money at home in cash

                  In my country you cannot buy a house or receive a salary in cash. I’m my previous comment i was pointing out that you are not forced to use cryptocurrency exchanges to use cryptocurrencies like bitcoin.

  • Blackout@fedia.io
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    1 day ago

    Corporations in America don’t pay taxes. They kill us slowly and erode our democracy and sponsor facism but they don’t pay taxes.

    • Hildegarde@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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      8 hours ago

      They don’t pay income tax, but they do pay tax. They pay payroll taxes when paying employees, and those employees have to pay income taxes on those wages.

      If you buy american, some of that money will go to the feds in taxes, and the US has a major corporate tax evasion problem. Both are true.

  • 9point6@lemmy.world
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    1 day ago

    They’re not the only options!

    There’s also… American Express

    How do we not have an international European card processor?

      • dynamoMaus@feddit.org
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        23 hours ago

        While it is partly true - look at how big lobbyorganisations of said companies are in Strasburg - I do not like how General this is. “All politicians are bought” is just straight up wrong.

    • bloubz@lemmygrad.ml
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      1 day ago

      I think that’s what things iDeal and Bancontact are for (respectively Netherlands and Belgium). This is a country wide payment system that is available in remotely every store/service, and sometimes the only accepted one

      Edit: it seems iDeal can sometimes be used outside of the Netherlands. Btw both systems are still controlled by banks

    • mearce@programming.dev
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      12 hours ago

      Visa at least probably doesn’t collect a per transaction surcharge on these transactions right? I mean, they probably do get your data and probably ultimately still cost you money in a round about way.

      • NotLemming@lemm.ee
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        9 hours ago

        I have no idea. I’ve wondered about buying those prepaid MasterCards for things where a card is needed. It’s kind of like you need to think like someone doing fraud just to opt out of a financial norms that you don’t agree with. People are already weirded out by someone paying cash here.

  • RambaZamba@feddit.org
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    23 hours ago

    There is already a solution inside the EU, the shops just have to support it now. “Over the course of 2025, banks will no longer be allowed to charge additional fees for instant transfers in euros. Banks in all 20 euro countries must also offer the real-time service as standard.”

  • lazycog@feddit.ukM
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    1 day ago

    Reminder: Arguing and discussion is okay, but keep it civil and do not attack the person you are arguing with.

  • Zorsith@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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    1 day ago

    Any time you use a card at a PoS terminal in the US, one of those two are likely the payment processor as well.