In case you don’t know, they explicitly use the term socialist to describe the Federation economy in SNW. I was wondering if ppl liked or hated it? I like it personally since it’s not a dodge like “new world economy”

  • bionicjoey@lemmy.ca
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    5 months ago

    Social ownership of what? Resources? Means of production? Neither of those means anything when replicators are a thing.

    There are a million different definitions of socialism depending on who you ask. I gave one above but I’m not claiming it’s the only one. However it is ultimately an economic model, and it doesn’t make sense to apply it in a world where economics is meaningless because the laws of thermodynamics have been broken.

    • Value Subtracted@startrek.websiteM
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      5 months ago

      Resources and means of production are both things in the Federation. We see mining operations and manufacturing facilities well into the 24th century.

      And with only one unfortunate exception that I can think of, matter replication is treated as a net energy loss - it isn’t free.

      • bionicjoey@lemmy.ca
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        5 months ago

        And with only one unfortunate exception that I can think of, matter replication is treated as a net energy loss - it isn’t free.

        Well sure, it’s energy negative, but they also have basically free energy. We see in Voyager that as soon as they are cut off from that free energy, they regress to a market-based economy by like the third episode of the show. Doesn’t seem very socialist to me.

        • Value Subtracted@startrek.websiteM
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          5 months ago

          as they are cut off from that free energy

          They were “cut off” because they no longer had access to the supply lines that provided them with fuel. That’s not “free energy” at all.

          • bionicjoey@lemmy.ca
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            5 months ago

            Yeah that’s my point. As soon as they no longer had access to the magical impossible logistics network of virtually free energy, they immediately regressed to capitalism with a side order of martial law.

            • Value Subtracted@startrek.websiteM
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              5 months ago

              I don’t think what they were doing in the Delta Quadrant would meet many (good) definitions of “capitalism.”

              And it’s difficult to say how “martial law” could be imposed on a command structure that was already militaristic.

    • trolololol@lemmy.world
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      5 months ago

      Then explain what the Orion syndicate does for a living. Or how can ferengi pursue profit. Or how captains owned private transport ships and need to take things from one place to the other.

      There’s always people who want more than they have, and know who’s going to provide them that.

      • zaphod@sopuli.xyz
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        5 months ago

        Neither the Orion Syndicate nor the Ferengi Alliance are members of the Federation.

        • Repple (she/her)@lemmy.world
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          5 months ago

          True for most of the franchise, but the ferengi are eventually. Also, I’m not sure if the federation prevents member worlds from continuing to have their own internal economies that could be market based. My guess is that they don’t and the ferengi will continue to use money for a long time.