• BoobaAwooga@lemmynsfw.com
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    28 days ago

    This point about Bernie winning has been belabored, however consider a 2016 election where the DNC didn’t collude for Hillary. Then we have Bernie as the ticket and beating trump and never hearing of that fucker again (hopefully). What a different world it would’ve been having Bernie as the 45th president

    • Orbituary@lemmy.world
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      28 days ago

      The point is to hammer this into the thick skulls of the people running the DNC. They keep forcing shit down our throats. It’s time for change.

    • P_P@lemm.ee
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      28 days ago

      The donors would have never stood for it, which is why the DNC did what it did.

        • Mjpasta710@midwest.social
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          27 days ago

          The DNC and RNC are 527 non profit companies.

          In a country where money == speech and corporations are allowed to use their freedom to speak freely.

          They’re actively supporting the largest voices in the room, corporations.

    • kryptonianCodeMonkey@lemmy.world
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      28 days ago

      Small tangent. Instead of reading it as bee-labored, I read belabored as bella-bored the first time and I was like, “Bela… bored…? Huh, that’s a new word. Let’s Google that! … Oh, I’m an idiot.”

    • Baron Von J@lemmy.world
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      28 days ago

      Which state’s primary votes did the DNC alter or override to give Hillary the nomination by popular vote instead for Bernie?

      • BananaTrifleViolin@lemmy.world
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        28 days ago

        The other candidates gradually stepped aside to allow Hillary to run. The big one being Joe Biden not running as it was her “turn”, allegedly after the deal between the Clintons and the Obamas.

        If Biden had run in 2016, he probably would have won. And Trump would be a footnote in history.

          • Schadrach@lemmy.sdf.org
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            26 days ago

            And it will be the greatest book you have ever read, just so bigly yuge, tremendous! Not like those Democrats and their small books, with the tiny writing and confusing words and no pictures.

            …I tried. Just imagine the pitch gradually increasing and the first part being all enthusiastic, then him dropping to a low pitch and trying to sound all grave for the second sentence. Someone else better at channeling orange asshole-ese?

        • Baron Von J@lemmy.world
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          27 days ago

          The other candidates gradually stepped aside to allow Hillary to run. The big one being Joe Biden not running as it was her “turn”, allegedly after the deal between the Clintons and the Obamas.

          Apologies, but I can’t tell if you’re trying to supplement my point or pose an answer to my question.

      • littlewonder@lemmy.world
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        27 days ago

        What if I told you it was also about manipulating voter opinions.

        Like how the superdelegates were all pledging their votes to Hillary way ahead of the first primaries. Or how the DNC pushed Hillary over Bernie, as was clear in the Debbie W.S. leaked DNC emails. Also, the widespread pressure from party darlings on Bernie to drop out.

        Messaging from the media was to blame as well. This was reflected in:

        • Lack of coverage of the polling that showed the better margin of success in a Bernie v. Trump matchup against a Hillary v. Trump matchup. This one is especially egregious, in my opinion, since a lot of the Hillary supporters I personally knew voted for her in the primaries because they assumed she had a better chance of winning.

        • Lack of coverage about Bernie’s higher popularity with independent voters in polls.

        • Widespread reporting when Hillary decided to label Bernie supporters as basement dwellers.

        • Hillary accused Bernie of being sexist and the media did terrible due diligence.

        • Baron Von J@lemmy.world
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          27 days ago

          Why not just tell me those things instead of making it a hypothetical?

          I think those are all valid points to raise and consider. I voted for Bernie in my primary and Hillary in the general.

          Like how the superdelegates were all pledging their votes to Hillary way ahead of the first primaries.

          Was there a single state, where the popular vote was for Bernie but the super delegates swept in and gave it Hillary instead?

          Or how the DNC pushed Hillary over Bernie

          This is not me shrugging it off as a totally cool and reasonable thing, but is that any different than any other election year, from either party, where the established power structure of the party has a preferred candidate? What I’m saying is I don’t think this is anything specifically anti-Bernie as much as a very well established pattern of nepotism that goes back centuries.

          as was clear in the Debbie W.S. leaked DNC emails.

          Correct me if I’m wrong, but did not the DNC emails show that proposed rat-fuckery was ultimately rejected?

          Also, the widespread pressure from party darlings on Bernie to drop out.

          Just par for the course, and not special opposition because Bernie is Bernie.

          Messaging from the media was to blame as well

          I agree with you that the media wasn’t fair in their coverage. Maybe just have been my own echo chamber but I do recall seeing polling data showing Bernie did better against Trump being brought up all over the place.

          However, I’m only pursuing discussion of the claims/sentiment that the DNC denied Bernie the nomination. I see that sentiment popping up a lot, and it always completely ignores the fact that Hillary won the popular vote in the primary. Just like Trump just won the popular vote in the general. The only way the parties will change is by enough people showing up in their primaries to nominate better candidates. They aren’t going to change because we’re mad about the results of the election. They don’t care what non-voters think because non-voters don’t win elections, voters do.

          • Schadrach@lemmy.sdf.org
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            27 days ago

            Was there a single state, where the popular vote was for Bernie but the super delegates swept in and gave it Hillary instead?

            Mine. West Virginia. Hillary got 35% of the primary vote while Bernie only got 51% and therefore she got one more delegate than Bernie. She literally only ever needed 30% of the primary vote in any state because of superdelegates.

            We had a local candidate who only ran in WV, whose whole purpose for running was to try to draw national attention to economically gutted regions of the state caused by the so-called war on coal who got 9% of the vote, and even he managed to outperform Hillary in one county (taking second, because Bernie won every county in WV) - when you’re behind a protest candidate anywhere, you done fucked up.

            • Baron Von J@lemmy.world
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              27 days ago

              Thank you! I’ve been asking that question for years and you’re the first to provide an example. Point conceded.

      • MegaUltraChicken@lemmy.world
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        28 days ago

        Yeah what I remember working on the campaign was a bunch of people didn’t show up and fucking vote in the primary and Bernie lost. Sure, there was some fuckery that shifted momentum but at the end of the day my fellow progressives didn’t get enough votes because we act like the DNC controls the outcome of the primaries and end up helping make that the reality ourselves.

        If all the people bitching about the DNC and telling everyone the Democrats are a lost cause showed up to vote in the primary, Bernie would’ve won.

        • Baron Von J@lemmy.world
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          27 days ago

          a bunch of people didn’t show up and fucking vote … and Bernie lost

          It’s obnoxious how often that’s why the conservatives win.

  • MerrySkeptic@sh.itjust.works
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    28 days ago

    I love Bernie. I know he would have beat Trump in 2016. Both tap into populist sentiment, albeit on different sides of the political spectrum. The difference is Bernie wouldn’t have any of the baggage that Trump brings with the racism, misogyny, incoherence, etc. he would have won easily. I weep for what would have been. He would have been a champion for the working class, not the charlatan that Trump is.

    I think one thing that the Republicans did that Dems didn’t is they let the people pick their candidate. It’s that simple. They didn’t care how unpolished he was, his lack of pedigree, anything. There was no ideological purity test. They duked it out in their primary and let the people decide. Something for the Dems to learn from.

  • Moobythegoldensock@lemm.ee
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    28 days ago

    He’s 83 years old, older than both Trump and Biden.

    I’d like to see AOC throw her hat in for 2028. She’ll be 39 then.

    • ifGoingToCrashDont@lemmy.world
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      28 days ago

      I’d love to see this but her chances are likely worse than Harris. And that’s assuming we have an honest election in '28.

      • tea@lemmy.today
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        28 days ago

        Maybe, maybe not. Looking at the answers from her “AOC and Trump” voter cross-section, it seems like you just need to run someone who’s “genuine.” Both of them are seen as genuine or real (whether that’s true or not, it doesn’t matter).

        Populism can cut both ways and AOC might be just the ticket we need.